I knew Woody Guthrie, Woody Guthrie was a friend of mine. Dixie Chicks, you are no Woody Guthrie
Bob Dylan said that. At least he should’ve.
An old-school protest singer who never got past the shadow of Dylan (Joan Baez) introduced the Dixie Chicks by making a comparison to Woody Guthrie’s defiant song “This Land is Your Land”.
Here’s the part of the song that most people don’t know:
As I was walkin’ – I saw a sign there
And that sign said – no tress passin’
But on the other side …. it didn’t say nothin!
Now that side was made for you and me!
This land is your land, this land is my land
From California, to the New York Island
From the redwood forest, to the gulf stream waters
This land was made for you and me
In the squares of the city – In the shadow of the steeple
Near the relief office – I see my people
And some are grumblin’ and some are wonderin’
If this land’s still made for you and me.
To the point that the Dixie Chicks are protesting the administration is fine, but to invoke Woody in the name of the Dixie Chicks whose Grammy was politically motivated, not musically motivated, bothers me. Bring in commenter “Peoria Guy” from PeoriaPundit who said: “I am also willing to bet that those “rolling their eyesâ€? about a Woody Guthrie comparison cannot even name two Guthrie songs.”
I’m not about to argue how many people can or cannot name Woody Guthrie songs. Frankly it doesn’t matter. The comparison is completely misguided.
If Bruce Springsteen, Neil Young, or even U2 were introduced with reference to Woody, I wouldn’t have a problem- because they not only play and sing music in the vein of Guthrie’s voice of protest and respect for the downtrodden, they understand the history and genealogy of the music. Bitching about President Bush doesn’t put you in Woody Guthrie’s league. Not even close.
Here’s Woody in a rare early video from 1945:
…and here’s early Dylan singing and talking about his mentor…
February 12th, 2007 at 10:19 pm
Did it ever occur to folks that the comparison to Guthrie wasn’t over the way the music sounds, but instead all about protest music?
February 12th, 2007 at 10:28 pm
Billy, I understand the surface comparison, but it has more to do with intelligence, integrity and knowledge of (music) history. In my opinion, the Dixie Chicks have none of those qualities.
February 13th, 2007 at 12:12 am
The Dixie Chicks are great at what they do.
Me thinks you underestimate their musical talent.
As singers and instrumentalists, they are superb. That such talent should make it to the #1 slot on the charts is encouraging…akin to MODERN TIMES reaching the #1 slot recently.
February 13th, 2007 at 3:43 am
Wow your going to tell Bob Dylan what he ought to say. Hmmm I’m sure “Bob” will be calling you up. What kind of idiot are you. Did you know Woody Guthrie? Is he a friend of yours? Look I can’t think of a better way to undermine your own argument than to suggest what a great song writer should say. If I cared about anything you might have to say it ended right there. I like the Dixie Chicks you don’t. End of story. Some folks like music and other folks live in a world where music represents things and the way they express them selves is by what they like and don’t like. They never produce anything and comment on everything. Your words are like a fart in the wind. P.S. I’m sure Woody didn’t shelter his income in Holland like your U2 but really what should Bob Dylan say about that. I’m just going to imagin what should Bob say? Huh how about what should Bob say? Your a swnuvling faggot yea the dick sucking kind you misrable peice of shit. I would shit on you happielly. Wow I love the chicks and you better hope I don’t have a gun when I meet you.
February 13th, 2007 at 6:03 am
The ‘chickens’ used their platform to make a political statement. Their political opponents and some regular folks made their statement by threatening not to listen to radio stations. The girls went political again by working the situation to their advantage. Now, their political allies have come to their defense with a political award. Your move……
What would Bob Dylan say?
Already said it…..”We live in a political world”
(1990)
February 13th, 2007 at 6:08 am
The DC are all about me, me, me. Woody would not be amused.
February 13th, 2007 at 6:20 am
I’m with you all the way. How Baez can be so stupid as to draw any comparison between Guthrie and commercial crap like The Dixie Chicks is beyond me. She should know better. Woody Guthrie was a genuine poet of the downtrodden who walked the walk every day of his life. If he was around today Bush would have him banned.
February 13th, 2007 at 6:26 am
At the very least it’s highly presumptuous to suggest that the Dixie Chicks have no connection (musically, spiritually or otherwise) with Woody Guthrie because they don’t “understand the history and genealogy of the music” or “play and sing music in the vein of Guthrie’s voice of protest and respect for the downtrodden”. And it’s moderately offensive to say they have no “intelligence, integrity and knowledge of (music) history”.
Conversely, it’s equally ridiculous to suggest that U2 are motivated by a deep sense of respect for their musical genealogy, that they are flawless musical integrity keepers and they possess an encyclopaedic knowledge of music history. Maybe that’s why Edge always wears a hat – to keep a plethora of musical facts that would rival the Smithsonian from falling out of his bald head every time he bends over.
Your comments are nothing more than a sweeping generalisation, wildly superficial and based on a perception; a scant understanding of who any of those people really are.
“Bitching about President Bush doesn’t put you in Woody Guthrie’s league”. Correct, and bitching about something you understand very little about (in this case the Dixie Chicks) doesn’t really do you any personal justice. You just end up looking silly and sounding even sillier. Maybe it would have been better to post a comment in the form of a question: Are the Dixie Chicks in the same league as Guthrie? Do they have a spiritual connection with the passions, loves, hates of Woody? You might’ve learned something.
February 13th, 2007 at 6:52 am
I like the Dixie Chicks but no…they’re not in the same league as Guthrie. Not even close. The DC are entertainers. Guthrie was a poet.
February 13th, 2007 at 7:08 am
I agree with you Pammy; but the comment above is still a woeful generalisation. And even though I wouldn’t say the DC’s are such sophisticated wordsmiths as WG, who’s to say they don’t care about the issued as much? Plus, they’re undeniably talented.
Enough from me
February 13th, 2007 at 7:11 am
I’m glad someone speaks up against such hokum. The Dixie Chicks are more related to The Spice Girls than they are to Woody Guthrie. Whatever they are, they are it lite. Comparing them to Woody (I’ve read a few bios and all) is pre-post-er-ous.
February 13th, 2007 at 8:23 am
Peoria Illinoisan-
Don’t underestimate their musical knowledge and experience. Natalie Maines’ father is Lloyd Maines the great producer and session player for artists as diverse as Joe Ely, Wilco, Guy Clark, Terry Allen, Butch Hancock and many more. I see a direct line between Guthrie and all of these artists and if Natalie grew up in an enviroment with this kind of music around, my guess is that she knows a thing or two about musical history & traditions and the Guthrie tradition in particular.
-Jeremy
February 13th, 2007 at 9:02 am
The Dixie Chicks are very talented but are not on the level of Dylan or Guthrie. They are more at the level of Barry McGuire (eve of destruction fame). Actually, they are more at the level of Joan Baez, so I guess having her introduce them makes sense. It’s an immature type of protest. I don’t think it has anything to do with knowledge of the genre or insincerity.
February 13th, 2007 at 9:09 am
I am a long time big fan of Bob Dylan (seen him 30 times)I also love Woody Guthrie and Joan Baez. The Dixie Chicks are OK in my book in fact they are very good – one of the few modern acts out there I like, they are both new and old school at the same time and Natalie has a great voice!
February 13th, 2007 at 9:16 am
Tom Johnson needs a spelling book.
Woody Guthrie is a freind of mine.
So is Bob Dylan.
February 13th, 2007 at 9:38 am
at least they`re not republicans
February 13th, 2007 at 11:19 am
Thank you to Tom Johnson for clearing it up for me. Apparently this is what Bob Dylan would have to say about to me about this: “Your a swnuvling faggot … I would shit on you happielly. Wow I love the chicks and you better hope I don’t have a gun when I meet you.”
All because I said the Dixie Chicks aren’t a worthy comparison to Woody, and I’m not alone.
February 13th, 2007 at 1:02 pm
There you go again putting words in Bobs mouth. Hey you don’t know any thing about what Bob would say. You somehow suggest that Bob Dylan adds weight to your argument. That’s why I would shit on you. Your shitting on Bob. You may be right Dylan might have been sitting at home and was insulted at the comparison. You don’t know that and to suggest that you do shows that you don’t know anything. You don’t know Bob I don’t know Bob and your isunuation that you do makes me sick. Your bringing the Dixie Chicks into it make me MAD. I guess you figure that the Chicks haven’t been bashed enough. That some woman who obviosly put alot of skill and craft into there music need some more dragging behind the cart.
February 13th, 2007 at 1:54 pm
Something to think about: Woody Guthrie had a large sticker proclaiming “This Machine Kills Fascists” plastered on his guitar. I wonder if he would have been ‘pro’ going into Iraq and removing a guy who gassed thousands of his own people and routinely tortured scores of others. And what about that fellow in Iran who threatens to “wipe Israel off the map”?
February 13th, 2007 at 3:12 pm
Very interesting discussion. Dixie Chicks are not in the league of Guthrie, and thus the comparison may not be apt. But I give the DC credit for having the guts to speak their mind, and I respect them greatly for it.
February 13th, 2007 at 5:52 pm
I would agree with that assessment, Bob in Maine, thanks for the comment.
February 13th, 2007 at 7:07 pm
“We live in a political world…” How very true. I don’t think anyone has ever said that the DC don’t have a right to speak their minds. Of course they do. But other people have a right to not listen to them either, and the DC shouldn’t act like spoiled little babies because people critcize them. It was obvious the award was based on politics, not music. Maybe they are talented, every musicians up there deserved the award. They are all talented. Also, it’s ridiculous to say that President Bush would have banned Woody Guthrie. What a load of crap!
Democrats are no better than Republicans at this sort of thing. They just say what makes Liberals feel better. And then do the opposite. Al Gore looked like a fool up there. Anthony Keidis of the Chile Peppers looked like he was trying to avoid Gore, who was determined to greet Keidis.
February 13th, 2007 at 9:15 pm
Of all the comments, I like that of Bob from Maine. They are popular artists, with a whole bunch more talent than half the acts out there.
The one that really gets me is David in Brooklyn. If he knew more about Woody, going into Iraq, going into any war needs to be taken with honesty. Did we invade Iraq to get rid of Saddam? The answer was no, until all the other reasons were found out to be lies. As for Iran, words don’t equal dids!!!
As for killing fascists, favoring business profits over the people, using war as the major tool of diplomacy and arresting people without habeaus corpus; would be something Woody Gutherie would speak out against.
February 14th, 2007 at 10:46 am
The only thing I have to say is, how lucky Woody was for being born in a time where he could play and record music and people wouldn’t sit around all day reviewing his every move and judging whether it came from authentic and original intentions, and then write about it on the internet. Had the Dixie Chix been around sixty years ago they might have had the luxury of “less press,” if i can even call it that, also. Bob and Woody stayed hidden, they stayed in the shadows and out of the public eye throughout their entire careers, artists today don’t have a chance to do that; and that is why a simple political opinion by an artist which was never intended to change the world at large has been twisted and manipulated into a tool for the people who have nothing better to do but argue over how we should run/ruin the country. I feel bad for the dixie chix, they should have the right to make bad music in peace.
February 14th, 2007 at 12:34 pm
Good music? Bad music? Its all music. They are all at heart “song and dance man” Tell Bob Dylan he’s a singer for the downtrodden and I think I can predict the reaction. Woody and the Dixie Chicks had a lot in common. They were singers. To me the Chick are more performers, Woody more of and author writer. Now dosn’t it scare you when you put together what the chicks said in England with what happend to them. They were villifyed. I can see why the people loyal to the president wanted to do that.They was no connection to 911 and Saddam and cooked intelegence for the WMD’s. They couldn’t take a chance that someone would point the finger and say “The Emporer Has no Clothes” They tried to kill there careers. I’m shocked the way that people fell for it. “yea you can’t say that” you sure can’t say it in england” like english singers never say any thing. They treated the chicks like the Jews in Nazi germany . I think woody would have loved the chicks as perfomers and marvled at the violin and banjo in pop music. but thats my opinion. I’ll certinly give Joan Baez more credability than you any day.
February 14th, 2007 at 4:26 pm
Wow, most of you are idiots.
Tom Johnson – what do you have up your ass? Why would you care what other people think Dylan might or might not have said…especially when you agree he might have said it! Some people like substance to their music. Why does that bother you? To me, it seems as if you’re the kind of person who will never amount to anything. Your rage is exceeded only by your poor spelling.
David K – You should get your facts checked, dumbass. If you knew Persian, you would understand that he never said to “wipe Israel off the map”. The direct translation reads: “erase the Zionist regime in Jerusalem from the page of time”. Doesn’t that sound like “regime change”. And it’s about time. Wouldn’t you consider the Israeli govt fascist considering its policies and the amount of dissent within that country? Just pick up a copy of Haaretz once. Fool. I cannot believe that phrase about “wiping off the map” is still floating around. Propaganda that Woody would certainly have spit upon. There are many out there who have an agenda to destroy Iran without regard for what would happen to America, and that is a crime beyond all crimes. Long live America, and may all the instigators receive the justice they deserve.
February 15th, 2007 at 1:18 am
Look, I know the DC are not in leagues w/ Guthrie, but where is all this venom coming from? Who cares what Baez says, listen to what Bob says… “I’m strong enough not to hate”. p.s. I like the Dixies, but Modern Times is far superior to any album they have put out. Just a opinion.
February 16th, 2007 at 6:08 pm
As the first and the greatest, all protest music will always be compared to Guthrie. The funny thing is that the Dixie Chicks didn’t write a protest song. They just said something that many people in their community disagreed with, and they were blacklisted. The country music world didn’t support their right to speak out.